Likelihood of insurance costs being recouped

Convicted Driver Insurance

Biglez

New Member
Long story short, last year (December 2022) I decided to drive after a couple drinks.

Took a back road home (which I never normally take, thinking it would be quieter, knowing full well I'd had a drink) and sadly, got acaught out and slide on some sheet ice straight into 2 parked cars. Unreal luck, eh?

Owners come out, smelt booze and phoned police as it was late at night.

Police arrive etc etc etc. pretty much bang on 6 months later, court date for end of June. 12 months with a 3 month reduction, drink driving course. so only 9 months.

Now, my policy was due to run out not more then a couple months later. I was a little naughty, said I had an accident but didn't delve into the details, they were aware police had the car with LJ Transport, remember this was back in December. Bought a new car etc and reinsured it.

They paid out for my vehicle (not much really) and the vehicles I hit, assuming they'd need courtasy cars.

My policy ended way before any actual conviction and I have not heard anything since, that was 3 months ago now the policy ended. I'd been on the phone with them numerous times as my cars are all modified etc so always changing parts and never any mention.

I formally have no contract with them, once a contract is over, it cannot be voided? How could they possibly recoup any loss when the conviction was way after my policy ended?

Am I worrying about nothing? After looking at the forum for potential costs in insurance for modified cars, I stumbled across thread and the sheer agony some members are going through with Admiral recouping obscene amounts of money. I am also a little worried when the time comes to drive again... Most places I have checked do not ask for arrest date but conviction date. The accident was bang on 6 months apart from the conviction and I also asked the insurance company, when my policy ended to forward my no claims (I retained 1 year) which they don't appear to have done so I little nervous about phoning again in 7 months time asking for proof of no claims, incase I poke the fire.

Cheers
 
davalav said:
Long story short, last year (December 2022) I decided to drive after a couple drinks.

Took a back road home (which I never normally take, thinking it would be quieter, knowing full well I'd had a drink) and sadly, got acaught out and slide on some sheet ice straight into 2 parked cars. Unreal luck, eh?

Owners come out, smelt booze and phoned police as it was late at night.

Police arrive etc etc etc. pretty much bang on 6 months later, court date for end of June. 12 months with a 3 month reduction, drink driving course. so only 9 months.

Now, my policy was due to run out not more then a couple months later. I was a little naughty, said I had an accident but didn't delve into the details, they were aware police had the car with LJ Transport, remember this was back in December. Bought a new car etc and reinsured it.

They paid out for my vehicle (not much really) and the vehicles I hit, assuming they'd need courtasy cars.

My policy ended way before any actual conviction and I have not heard anything since, that was 3 months ago now the policy ended. I'd been on the phone with them numerous times as my cars are all modified etc so always changing parts and never any mention.

I formally have no contract with them, once a contract is over, it cannot be voided? How could they possibly recoup any loss when the conviction was way after my policy ended?

Am I worrying about nothing? After looking at the forum for potential costs in insurance for modified cars, I stumbled across thread and the sheer agony some members are going through with Admiral recouping obscene amounts of money. I am also a little worried when the time comes to drive again... Most places I have checked do not ask for arrest date but conviction date. The accident was bang on 6 months apart from the conviction and I also asked the insurance company, when my policy ended to forward my no claims (I retained 1 year) which they don't appear to have done so I little nervous about phoning again in 7 months time asking for proof of no claims, incase I poke the fire.

Cheers
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You have basically just committed insurance fraud, so not only do you have a DUI to contend with, you have defrauded the insurance company by not informing them of the FACTS behind the accident. You them too out insurance on a new car, which is fine as you hadn't been convicted of anything at that point, and had not cost your licence. Now you have lost your licence, you are no longer able to insure a car, either on or off road.

So I would;

a) Inform the insurance company that you were convicted of drink driving. It is then up to them whether or not they recoup costs (but highly likely.)
b) Cancel your insurance on the new car you have bought. If you don't and they cancel it, that is even more of an issue as you will be deemed to have been refused insurance.

I have to ask though, why did you do this? You will be caught. You have also completely misunderstood the terms of the contract between you and your insurance company. Dig out and read the conditions. The onus is on you to inform the company of any material facts affecting the policy. All of the damage as a result of the accident occurred while the policy was extant.

You have gotten yourself into a pickle and need to sort it out before you find yourself in even deeper water or even charged with fraud.

So you haven't been a 'little naughty,' you've just bee stupid.

Sorry.
 
"b) Cancel your insurance on the new car you have bought. If you don't and they cancel it, that is even more of an issue as you will be deemed to have been refused insurance."

I should clarify I have NO insurance policies on any vehicle. It ended months ago. I bought a new car back in December right after the accident, moved my policy over to the new one and haven't driven since the policy ended.

They were well aware police were involved and had the police report (They needed the police report so their engineers could assess the damage after LJ was done with it) but nothing was ever mentioned and because I was and I qoute "released without charge". They didn't even tell me I was being investigated either and to be honest, I was so shaken up and tired (ordeal lasted for almost 10 hours including hospital visit) from the accident, amazingly, it never even crossed my mind nor has it up until yesterday over 9 months later.

Now, their wording states that they'll pay out the minimum in accordance to the road traffic regulations with a drink or drug conviction- Nothing more. There is nothing in the wording that states they will recoup or come after me in the event of a drink or drug driving conviction. I no longer contract with them, nor do they have my consent to join any contract or be contacted.

Despite this, the contract/policy ended way before any court dates and conviction, even if I had told them I was arrested for suspicion, up to that point I was innocent until proven otherwise - which came way after the policy end date - Whilst no longer under contract, I have no obligation to contact them to inform them.

In that case then nearly everyone I know who have crashed because of driving over the speed limit have all commited fraud numerous times? In actual fact, I know quite a few people who have over 6-9 points on their licenses (all speeding) and have never told insurance about them. I know one guy well into his 70s whos never told his insurance about any crashes, points or anything of the like.
 
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davalav said:
"b) Cancel your insurance on the new car you have bought. If you don't and they cancel it, that is even more of an issue as you will be deemed to have been refused insurance."

I should clarify I have NO insurance policies on any vehicle. It ended months ago. I bought a new car back in December right after the accident, moved my policy over to the new one and haven't driven since the policy ended.

They were well aware police were involved and had the police report (They needed the police report so their engineers could assess the damage after LJ was done with it) but nothing was ever mentioned and because I was and I qoute "released without charge". They didn't even tell me I was being investigated either and to be honest, I was so shaken up and tired (ordeal lasted for almost 10 hours including hospital visit) from the accident, amazingly, it never even crossed my mind nor has it up until yesterday over 9 months later.

Now, their wording states that they'll pay out the minimum in accordance to the road traffic regulations with a drink or drug conviction- Nothing more. There is nothing in the wording that states they will recoup or come after me in the event of a drink or drug driving conviction. I no longer contract with them, nor do they have my consent to join any contract or be contacted.

Despite this, the contract/policy ended way before any court dates and conviction, even if I had told them I was arrested for suspicion, up to that point I was innocent until proven otherwise - which came way after the policy end date - Whilst no longer under contract, I have no obligation to contact them to inform them.

In that case then nearly everyone I know who have crashed because of driving over the speed limit have all commited fraud numerous times? In actual fact, I know quite a few people who have over 6-9 points on their licenses (all speeding) and have never told insurance about them. I know one guy well into his 70s whos never told his insurance about any crashes, points or anything of the like.
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You cannot have a car insurance policy if you do not hold a licence. You need to cancel this asap as the policy will not pay out if your car is stolen or damaged, even though you don't drive it.

Regarding your original policy, it matters not when it ended, provided that date was after the date of the accident then your insurance company will pay out. You say they paid you and all the 3rd parties, but I am surprised they haven't asked you to return any monies paid to you as they will by now know you are convicted of drink driving. Who are you insured with, as all major insurers have a clause saying they MAY claw back 3rd party costs from you. Of course it may just be too soon for them to notify you as they may not have collated all of the costs.

Your driving ban will not start until after you have been to court, but as this is ALWAYS after the event, it is the condition you were in at the time of the accident that counts, otherwise no 3rd party would be covered for any damage caused by a drink driver.

I'm actually not entirely clear why you have posted on here as you don't seem to be looking for advice but are merely boasting about what a clever boy you have been by deceiving the insurance company.

BTW, which insurance company are you with?
 
davalav said:
Long story short, last year (December 2022) I decided to drive after a couple drinks.

Took a back road home (which I never normally take, thinking it would be quieter, knowing full well I'd had a drink) and sadly, got acaught out and slide on some sheet ice straight into 2 parked cars. Unreal luck, eh?

Owners come out, smelt booze and phoned police as it was late at night.

Police arrive etc etc etc. pretty much bang on 6 months later, court date for end of June. 12 months with a 3 month reduction, drink driving course. so only 9 months.

Now, my policy was due to run out not more then a couple months later. I was a little naughty, said I had an accident but didn't delve into the details, they were aware police had the car with LJ Transport, remember this was back in December. Bought a new car etc and reinsured it.

They paid out for my vehicle (not much really) and the vehicles I hit, assuming they'd need courtasy cars.

My policy ended way before any actual conviction and I have not heard anything since, that was 3 months ago now the policy ended. I'd been on the phone with them numerous times as my cars are all modified etc so always changing parts and never any mention.

I formally have no contract with them, once a contract is over, it cannot be voided? How could they possibly recoup any loss when the conviction was way after my policy ended?

Am I worrying about nothing? After looking at the forum for potential costs in insurance for modified cars, I stumbled across thread and the sheer agony some members are going through with Admiral recouping obscene amounts of money. I am also a little worried when the time comes to drive again... Most places I have checked do not ask for arrest date but conviction date. The accident was bang on 6 months apart from the conviction and I also asked the insurance company, when my policy ended to forward my no claims (I retained 1 year) which they don't appear to have done so I little nervous about phoning again in 7 months time asking for proof of no claims, incase I poke the fire.

Cheers
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You have committed criminal insurance fraud by not informing your insurance that you were arrested pending conviction when you crashed your car. If they do find out now it’s not solely recouping the costs you need to worry about, you have committed fraud by false representation by claiming for your own vehicle. Generally is about 9-12 months before to police release the report to insurance so you are not out of the danger zone for that yet.

I’m skeptical of your claims about people not declaring points when points are on the MID for the last few years. Maybe if these people were doing that 10 years ago yeah, but not anymore. I nearly had a policy voided when I declared I had 3 points when I had 6 as I thought 3 had expired. They rang me within a few hours of the policy starting to state that the MID shows I have 6 points and they would not allow me to amend. They intended to void me but allowed me to cancel it myself.
 
Luna2000 said:
You cannot have a car insurance policy if you do not hold a licence. You need to cancel this asap as the policy will not pay out if your car is stolen or damaged, even though you don't drive it.

Regarding your original policy, it matters not when it ended, provided that date was after the date of the accident then your insurance company will pay out. You say they paid you and all the 3rd parties, but I am surprised they haven't asked you to return any monies paid to you as they will by now know you are convicted of drink driving. Who are you insured with, as all major insurers have a clause saying they MAY claw back 3rd party costs from you. Of course it may just be too soon for them to notify you as they may not have collated all of the costs.

Your driving ban will not start until after you have been to court, but as this is ALWAYS after the event, it is the condition you were in at the time of the accident that counts, otherwise no 3rd party would be covered for any damage caused by a drink driver.

I'm actually not entirely clear why you have posted on here as you don't seem to be looking for advice but are merely boasting about what a clever boy you have been by deceiving the insurance company.

BTW, which insurance company are you with?
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I agree if you have been done for drink driv
RevokeNI said:
You have committed criminal insurance fraud by not informing your insurance that you were arrested pending conviction when you crashed your car. If they do find out now it’s not solely recouping the costs you need to worry about, you have committed fraud by false representation by claiming for your own vehicle. Generally is about 9-12 months before to police release the report to insurance so you are not out of the danger zone for that yet.

I’m skeptical of your claims about people not declaring points when points are on the MID for the last few years. Maybe if these people were doing that 10 years ago yeah, but not anymore. I nearly had a policy voided when I declared I had 3 points when I had 6 as I thought 3 had expired. They rang me within a few hours of the policy starting to state that the MID shows I have 6 points and they would not allow me to amend. They intended to void me but allowed me to cancel it myself.
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its not insurance fraud yes as in most policies you need to inform them of any changes as soon as possible but until you have been convicted your insurance is still valid . Yes they will try to get back 3 rd party claim but they already have insurance bucket fund to do this so they try to get it from you first. As for your costs it depends on your insurance policy mine paid out but I have noticed they have changed the wording since
 
nats said:
I agree if you have been done for drink driv

its not insurance fraud yes as in most policies you need to inform them of any changes as soon as possible but until you have been convicted your insurance is still valid . Yes they will try to get back 3 rd party claim but they already have insurance bucket fund to do this so they try to get it from you first. As for your costs it depends on your insurance policy mine paid out but I have noticed they have changed the wording since
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It IS insurance fraud. Unlike most items that are purchased (caveat emptor - let the buyer beware), insurance operates under Uberrima fides (utmost good faith) which means that you have to make them aware of something that is potentially relevant, whether you know it or not. Drink driving is relevant to the accident, so withholding this part of the story is fraudulent.

The thing to realise is that if you are convicted of insurance fraud, you are well and truly screwed! Not only do you risk a prison sentence, you are recorded on the insurance databases as fraudulent which will make your life really difficult going forward. Really difficult to obtain any insurance in the future, mortgages are probably a no-no and travel to certain places will be restricted. Unlike a drink drive conviction which can be viewed as a mistake, fraud is seen as a deliberate act and shows dishonesty.

You might get away with it, but then again you might not!
 
nats said:
I agree if you have been done for drink driv

its not insurance fraud yes as in most policies you need to inform them of any changes as soon as possible but until you have been convicted your insurance is still valid . Yes they will try to get back 3 rd party claim but they already have insurance bucket fund to do this so they try to get it from you first. As for your costs it depends on your insurance policy mine paid out but I have noticed they have changed the wording since
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It is indeed insurance fraud, it is fraud by omission which makes up a large portion of my caseload in work. @BigTom has covered the exact reason why in his comment before I had a chance to reply.
 
RevokeNI said:
It is indeed insurance fraud, it is fraud by omission which makes up a large portion of my caseload in work. @BigTom has covered the exact reason why in his comment before I had a chance to reply.
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BigTom said:
It IS insurance fraud. Unlike most items that are purchased (caveat emptor - let the buyer beware), insurance operates under Uberrima fides (utmost good faith) which means that you have to make them aware of something that is potentially relevant, whether you know it or not. Drink driving is relevant to the accident, so withholding this part of the story is fraudulent.

The thing to realise is that if you are convicted of insurance fraud, you are well and truly screwed! Not only do you risk a prison sentence, you are recorded on the insurance databases as fraudulent which will make your life really difficult going forward. Really difficult to obtain any insurance in the future, mortgages are probably a no-no and travel to certain places will be restricted. Unlike a drink drive conviction which can be viewed as a mistake, fraud is seen as a deliberate act and shows dishonesty.

You might get away with it, but then again you might not!
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RevokeNI said:
It is indeed insurance fraud, it is fraud by omission which makes up a large portion of my caseload in work. @BigTom has covered the exact reason why in his comment before I had a chance to reply.
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No it’s not fraud as long as you inform your insurance company of any changes. I’m of that age where my eyesight was of the legal limit who knew. It’s up to you to inform your insurance company of any changes read the small print basically they take your money and when it comes to making a claim they try to get out of it
 
nats said:
No it’s not fraud as long as you inform your insurance company of any changes. I’m of that age where my eyesight was of the legal limit who knew. It’s up to you to inform your insurance company of any changes read the small print basically they take your money and when it comes to making a claim they try to get out of it
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I'm sorry but you are completely wrong. I'm not sure what your eyesight has to do with with anything, but the OP withholding that his accident was down to drink driving IS fraud!
 
BigTom said:
I'm sorry but you are completely wrong. I'm not sure what your eyesight has to do with with anything, but the OP withholding that his accident was down to drink driving IS fraud!
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No fraud on my part I admitted drink driving and got my sentence
 
Good for you but it’s your obligation to inform of any dvla changes is in circumstances I thought my eye sight was pert
 
nats said:
No it’s not fraud as long as you inform your insurance company of any changes. I’m of that age where my eyesight was of the legal limit who knew. It’s up to you to inform your insurance company of any changes read the small print basically they take your money and when it comes to making a claim they try to get out of it
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As stated in my previous comment, what OP has done is insurance fraud. I work in the insurance industry. Since your latest replies are complete nonsense I’m not going to engage with you any further than this.
 
The OP has not read and understood the Admiral drink and drugs exclusion clause.
It does not depend on a conviction.
If they believe you were over the legal limit at the time of the incident your policy will be cancelled and no cover provided.

Also, the 'contract' requires the policyholder to notify the insurer of all the details of the accident.

Failure to disclose relevant information is classed as reckless/deliberate or careless.
 
Depressed Dad said:
The OP has not read and understood the Admiral drink and drugs exclusion clause.
It does not depend on a conviction.
If they believe you were over the legal limit at the time of the incident your policy will be cancelled and no cover provided.

Also, the 'contract' requires the policyholder to notify the insurer of all the details of the accident.

Failure to disclose relevant information is classed as reckless/deliberate or careless.
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Not sure he confirmed which company insured him.
 
Depressed Dad said:
Ah good point
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Anyway, although the conviction may have happened after the policy expired it still relates to a claim whilst the policy was active.

If a claim comes in after a policy expires, e.g., you have three years to submit a personal injury claim, the insurer is still on the hook to deal with it.
 
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